Panel on Political Neutrality and Israel

This transcript was generated automatically. Its accuracy may vary

Short Summary
The panel discussed the challenges brethren face regarding political involvement, emphasizing their role as ambassadors of God’s kingdom who should remain neutral despite living as citizens affected by political decisions. They noted that political polarization has increased, causing tension within the community, and advised focusing on scriptural principles, humility, and compassion to navigate differing opinions without becoming emotionally entangled. Regarding Israel, the elders explored its current legal and spiritual status, agreeing that while the Mosaic law covenant ended, God’s moral law remains eternal; they stressed that Israel is undergoing divine judgment and correction, with future restoration and kingdom establishment dependent on Israel turning to God rather than relying solely on political or military actions.

Long Summary
Detailed Summary of the Panel Discussion on Political Views and Israel in God’s Eyes

Introduction and Context
– The panel consists of eight elders discussing various topics without a fixed agenda.
– Initial casual comments about weather and scheduling were made.
– The main focus emerged on political views among brethren and the situation of Israel.

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### Part 1: Political Views and Engagement of Consecrated Christians

General Observations on Political Engagement
– Brethren see themselves as ambassadors of the Lord’s kingdom (2 Corinthians 5:20: “Now then, we are ambassadors for Christ…”) and thus should lightly touch earthly matters.
– Despite this, as citizens, they have duties and privileges affecting their lives and ecclesias.
– Political changes often affect different social groups unevenly, leading to differing opinions and potential tensions within the brotherhood.
– Historical references: Different opinions existed even during the New Deal era in the US.

Historical Perspectives from Brethren in Europe
– In communist Poland and Eastern Europe, political involvement was minimal due to oppressive regimes.
– Brethren viewed political events as prophetic signs rather than opportunities for political activism.
– After the fall of the Soviet Union, some brethren began to show more political interest.
– In democratic countries, the complexity of political engagement increased, especially when governments support or tolerate behaviors considered sinful biblically.

Current Realities and Challenges
– Political polarization is more extreme today than in the past, making neutrality challenging.
– Supporting any political party is recognized as problematic; no party can bring the kingdom.
– Jesus Himself had political opinions but did not engage in political activism (e.g., His response to the Pharisees about Herod, calling them hypocrites).
– Brethren are encouraged to have opinions on issues but avoid party alignment and activism.

Satan’s Role in Division
– Satan attempts to sow division among brethren, historically through doctrinal disputes; now more politically.
– The world’s problems of corruption and injustice prompt brethren’s desire to “fix” the world, but scripture teaches the old order will be destroyed (cf. putting new wine in old wineskins).
– The kingdom will bring real improvement, not current political entities.

Sources of Political Opinions
– Opinions often arise from personal weaknesses, emotional reactions to perceived injustice, and confirmation bias.
– The importance of humility and recognizing pride as a root cause of conflict was emphasized (John 14:30: “the ruler of this world… has nothing in me”).
– Personality differences affect how brethren interpret and apply truth, leading to diverse political opinions within the fellowship.

Influences on Young People
– Youth receive opinions from family, media, school, and environment.
– Media sources are often biased or slanted, complicating the search for truth.
– Free moral agency is influenced and sometimes constrained by external factors.
– Brethren must weigh opinions against godly principles.

Practical Advice on Political Discussions Among Brethren
– Maintain neutrality and avoid emotional or strife-filled debates.
– Scriptures useful for guidance include:
– Proverbs 23: “It is an honor for a man to cease from strife…”
– James 3:16: “Where envying and strife is, there is confusion and every evil work.”
– Philippians 3:20: “For our citizenship is in heaven.”
– Romans 14:1, 13: Avoid quarrels over opinions and judgment.
– Ecclesiastes 7:9 and James 1:19-20: Control anger and be slow to speak.
– Techniques to defuse discussions: Redirect conversation to the kingdom (“That’s why the world needs the kingdom”).
– Recognize political systems as temporary and imperfect.
– Be peacemakers and examples of thankfulness for current governments while looking forward to the kingdom.

Understanding Political Complexities
– Political decisions often have unintended consequences (example: US-China tariffs leading to deforestation in Brazil).
– Brethren are encouraged to discern “signal from noise”—separating emotional hype from prophetic or meaningful developments.
– Trust in God’s providential control over world events (quote from Brother Russell on the Lord’s great army managing discontents and reformers).

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### Part 2: Israel in God’s Eyes—Current Situation and Divine Judgment

Global Division on Israel
– Israel’s inclusion in events like Eurovision led to boycotts, reflecting polarized world opinion.
– Many countries and individuals either strongly support or oppose Israel, often based on preconceived biases.

Legal Status of Israel Regarding the Old Covenant
– Discussion on whether Israel today is under the Mosaic Law or old covenant:
– Romans 10:4: “For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.”
– Brother Russell’s writings: The Mosaic Law covenant ended with Christ, but God’s moral law remains eternal.
– The covenant includes blessings and condemnation; Jews not accepting Christ remain under condemnation.
– The ceremonial aspects of the law ended at the cross; moral commandments persist (Galatians 3:19).
– The national covenant and God’s legal dealings with Israel are complex and partly in suspension until the kingdom.

Current Condition and Prophetic Outlook
– Israel experiences judgment and purification (Ezekiel 20, Isaiah 1:25, Zephaniah 2-3).
– The nation is largely secular; many rely on weapons and alliances rather than God.
– Prophecies indicate a coming correction and turning of Israel’s heart to God.
– The bloodshed and conflict (e.g., Gaza war) are difficult to fully understand; media bias complicates truth.
– Israel’s actions, including military responses, are seen as self-defense but sometimes extreme.
– God’s patience and justice will ultimately prevail; the kingdom will restore Israel.

Prophetic Warnings and Encouragement
– Prophecies like Ezekiel 38-39 and Psalm 83 point to future events involving Israel and her neighbors.
– Acts 10:34-35 reminds that God shows no partiality: “Whoever fears Him and works righteousness is accepted by Him.”
– Jeremiah 18:5-10 illustrates God’s sovereign control over nations, allowing repentance and judgment.
– The situation is dynamic; God’s judgment is based on obedience and righteousness rather than purely political considerations.

Practical Implications for Brethren
– Support for Israel is important as part of God’s plan, but unconditional approval of all actions is not automatic.
– Recognize the complexity and avoid simplistic judgments.
– Trust in God’s ultimate plan and timing.
– Be cautious of media narratives and manipulation.
– Encourage brethren to focus on spiritual priorities and the kingdom.

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### Key Bible Verses Referenced

Political and Ambassadorship Theme:
– 2 Corinthians 5:20: “Now then, we are ambassadors for Christ…”
– Philippians 3:20: “For our citizenship is in heaven…”
– John 18:36: “My kingdom is not of this world.”
– Romans 14:1, 13: “Accept the one weak in faith… Let us not judge one another.”
– Proverbs 23: “It is an honor for a man to cease from strife…”
– James 3:16: “Where envying and strife is, there is confusion…”
– Ecclesiastes 7:9: “Do not be eager in your spirit to be angry…”
– James 1:19-20: “Be swift to hear, slow to speak, slow to wrath…”

Israel and Covenant Theme:
– Romans 10:4: “For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.”
– Galatians 3:19: “The law was added because of transgressions, until the Seed should come…”
– John 14:30: “The ruler of this world is coming. He has nothing in me.”
– Acts 10:34-35: “God shows no partiality but accepts those who fear Him and do righteousness.”
– Jeremiah 18:5-10: God as the potter shaping nations according to their obedience.
– Ezekiel 20, Isaiah 1:25, Zephaniah 2-3: Prophecies of judgment and restoration of Israel.

Quotes from Brother Russell:
– Commentary on the end of the law covenant but continuation of God’s eternal moral law.
– The Lord’s great army includes various societal groups used by God for His purposes.
– The importance of waiting on God’s plan rather than political involvement.

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### Overall Themes and Conclusions

– Brethren are encouraged to maintain neutrality and avoid political activism, recognizing their role as ambassadors of Christ and citizens of heaven.
– Political divisions within the brotherhood often stem from personal weaknesses, pride, or different life experiences and environments.
– Emotional political debates should be handled with scriptural wisdom, patience, and a focus on unity and peace.
– The situation in Israel is complex, involving a mix of divine judgment, human politics, and prophetic fulfillment.
– Support for Israel should be grounded in understanding God’s plan rather than political bias.
– Trust in God’s providence and the eventual establishment of the kingdom should be the foundation for brethren’s views and interactions.

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This summary captures the depth and breadth of the panel’s discussion, blending scriptural insights, historical context, and practical counsel for brethren navigating political and international issues in the light of their Christian faith.

Transcript

Brethren, this is our all elders panel discussion, and we have elders, eight elders here. Brother Christy contacted me yesterday and he said that he may be able to talk with us or participate with us through through Zoom, and I see that he is connected. There is no one topic of our discussion.

I thought that maybe we can have few topics that are presently interesting for us, and I thought that we have two hours. So I had many questions. Then I thought that we changed it to one hour. So I reduced the list of questions and Barack corrected me.

We have 19 minutes. So maybe we can use one more question in our discussion. But talking about current subject, I think we should start talking about weather.

I saw minus one in my car. What was the temperature in your car? I mean outside. So it’s quite experience with this low temperature. I don’t know.

We should cancel, for example, hold December and have it only through Zoom or not. We hope that we will get better weather soon. Okay, so first real question is related to.

Our political views and discussions that could be quite emotional among us, and recent events, I would say even pandemic created the atmosphere that the countries polarize in views on pandemics, on government action during the pandemic, and after that in political decisions related to our two things in our country, and I think that we have this view that when we become consecrated Christian, we think ourselves as ambassadors of the kingdom, Lord’s kingdom, and we should just touch lightly things on this earth, on this world, and because of that we should not be actively involved in political life or kind of support any political parties in countries where we live.

But in practice we are citizens of our country. We have our privileges and we have our duties as a citizen, and some decisions, some changes, political changes affect us very much. That would not affect ambassadors who would be immune to certain things. So because those changes affect us directly affect our life, then I would say we are more involved in things that happens around us and affect our our families, our ecclesias.

Sometimes those changes, political changes affect one part of society more than the other, and if in the class we have parts from different groups in society and one is more affected by changes than others, then there is discussion and maybe one group defend one change that others attack and say that it’s a very bad change.

So I think that causes discussions and that can cause some tensions among us, and I think this is not something recent. Maybe there is a change. But some time ago Brother Karl told me that when the New Deal was introduced here in the US There were different views on this New Deal, and he Said that he and Sister Margie had different opinions.

I’m not sure what their discussions were about that, but he said that they had different opinions about that. So I would like to ask the oldest brethren among us here if they remember how it was before. Did brethren discuss political issues and were very much engaged in those discussions. Do you remember?

No. Okay, I will ask maybe Brother Chris and Brother John. Do you remember any discussion? How was it among brothers in your countries?

We had a brief. It’s on. Okay. We had a brief exchange here with Brother John just before we started about how the different political events are watched, observed by the brethren in Europe and definitely in our respective countries that we come from. So I will share that.

From my perspective, when I was leaving Poland, that was in the mid-80s or late-80s, that was at the brink of that turn of the changeover from the communist regime to the more free thinking society, and there was definitely a lot of unrest, and at that time, of course, from my kind of much younger person’s perspective, I saw that some brethren were getting quite involved. I, for example, grew up in an environment with brethren who were quite the observers of the events. They were trying to not really be involved politically in one or the other side of the discussion, but rather seeing how these events might imply something prophetic.

And the big changes that were taking place back then just overall in the. The removal of the old communist bloc were really quite, you know, implied so much possible import in the prophetic view. So that was like the perspective that I recall from those days then. Okay. What I remember growing up was that brethren were not really involved a lot in politics.

Very little, of course, my life overlapped a little bit more when the Soviet Union fell, and of course now you have different options. We could see how certain brethren started to maybe tend toward liberty or other things. But in the same time, I remember my dad and brethren were telling me how they were just not involved, and maybe it was easier because when the election time came, there was only one option to vote for.

So for them it was so clear that that’s not anything that we. But on the other hand, maybe it was a little bit easier for brethren to discern because the system was completely against the religious beliefs. So it may be easier. I think he made it a little bit easier for the brethren to know that yes, this is Satan’s system and this is. It’s allowed from God, but it’s not anything that we have to do in our.

And we grew up the same where we just were not concerned. Even after I Came here, I didn’t learn or know anything until I had to take my citizenship and I had to learn everything what’s happening in the US But I can see how this can be a little bit challenging because we’re living in a country where the country supports or it’s considered the religious, or more than that, maybe even the president, and of course, many of you brethren witnessed how the country started maybe to go in a direction where certain behaviors or certain things were allowed that we completely know that they are condemned as sinful by the Bible, and now how do we deal with that as Christians? If you look in the time of the kings, of course the prophets used to go to the kings and, and condemn that.

Is that our responsibility? And I can see how things can happen here. Thank you. Thank you very John. So my question would be now, so how do we get involved?

How do we kind of get our political views and support? Is it mainly because we oppose something that is on the other side and we just don’t want to have anything with that, or do we really kind of get engaged and support one side because of ideas of program that we like? So who. Brother Tom? Well, one of the questions you asked us is, does any brethren believe that any political party can bring the kingdom?

And I think the answer is, of course not. Brethren don’t believe that. But I think what happens is that one political party might have a position that they agree with, and so they tend to gravitate towards that, and so you can gravitate towards both parties, depending on what positions they have. You asked the question about brethren today having political views.

I think it’s more prominent now than it has ever been in this country amongst the Brethren, because the political world today is much more divided and much more extreme, and so I think for us, we have to be careful. You can support a position without supporting a party, and I have had discussion with brethren and it has become very emotional because they feel by supporting a party indirectly, they’re supporting their viewpoints. But we have to understand that there’s no political party that has the answers for the kingdom.

And so your opening statement about our ambassadorship is important that we should stay away from these. That doesn’t mean we can’t have an opinion about a position, and in fact, I’ll even mention Jesus had a political opinion. Remember when the Pharisees told him, well, Herod is going to kill you, and Jesus response to that was, well, tell him all the good that I’m doing.

Tell that Fox all the good that I’m doing well. That’s not a compliment he definitely had. That’s a negative opinion he had. When Jesus observed the scribes and Pharisees, he wasn’t neutral. He called them scribes, Pharisees, hypocrites.

So he had a political opinion, but he didn’t follow through on it. He had the opinion, he kept it separate, and he continued with his work. So we cannot let ourselves become distracted by what’s happening in the world. We have to stay neutral. There’s a great quote by Brother Russell in the first forward of the fourth volume.

I won’t read it, but it’s a very political opinion that he expresses, and even in the fourth volume, he names names. We don’t go as far as he did in that extent, but I think our position has to be ambassadorship and we have to stay removed from them even if their positions affect us in our lives. Yeah. You mentioned Brother Russell.

I think he will get a job in newspaper as a political commentator at that time. Yeah. So who else would have a thought? How do we get those opinions? Brother Joe, again, in your opening remark, you mentioned how polarized the world is today, how divided it is.

And Satan has always tried to sow divisiveness in the world and in the church by various means. Again, you asked us earlier if the older ones among us could remember whether or not Brethren back when we were young, we’re discussing politics and none of us really could in this country. Because in this country Satan’s efforts to sow division among the Brethren was along lines of doctrinal or prophetic or chronological understandings. Not so much about politics. That has changed since we were young.

And now it is a different circumstance in the world, and I think Satan is still trying to divide the world and the Brethren more along political lines today. Now, along the lines of what others have said. We are principled Christians. We are rightly indignant at the corruption, the unrighteousness and the injustice that we see everywhere in the world and today, not just in government.

And so we might be inclined to want to help improve the world. If there is a movement out there or a party or a group that seems to be doing good, we might want to choose their side because we think they have more potential to eliminate some of that corruption and unrighteousness and injustice that we see so prevalent in the world today. But as we all know, this old order will be destroyed, and so any involvement in taking one side or the other is sort of like trying to put new wine in old wineskins or like putting a new patch on an old garment. Such sentiments or efforts, I think, are in opposition to God’s will and plan, which will destroy all of the old order.

It is not for us to try to take a side now, even though we think they have the best ideas to help make the world better. The world is not going to get better now. It’s going to be destroyed. Okay, thank you. But I would like to go a little deeper into this question.

How do we get that, these sympathies? Because I think this is difficult, because I try to understand myself, because I have some positions and I try to stay away from being actively involved. But I see one side, let’s say, that have better decision other than maybe less, and when I see the brethren who have completely different position, I’m thinking, well, how did they get to that position if I have completely different one? So is it home?

Is it environment, school? How do we get that? Robert, just briefly, I think when I am not neutral and take a side on an issue or something, it’s usually my weakness that does it, and it’s often caused by observation of something like a lie or an injustice, and it causes a visceral reaction in me.

And I will blurt something out loud because I’m disgusted by what someone else has said or the untruth or the perspective that I have that what they’re saying may be wrong or unfair, and so that’s the start, and then if I continue to feed that opinion, I will find articles or, you know, sources that will help me justify that perspective. So I’d say for me, it’s a weakness, as the brethren have said. I don’t think we should be involved at all because there’s a greater thing at work here at this time.

It’s the Lord’s great army, and Brother Russell in volume four has an excellent quote I’d like to read if we feel like we have time. It’s short, and this is from the Battle of Armageddon, Chapter Study 11, page 550. The Lord, by his overruling providence, will take a general charge of this great army of discontents, patriots, reformers, socialists, moralists, anarchists, ignorance and hopeless, and use their hopes, fears, follies and selfishness, according to his divine wisdom, to work out his own grand purposes in the overthrow of present institutions and for the preparation of man for the kingdom of righteousness.

For this reason only, it is termed the Lord’s great Army. None of his saints, none who are led by the Spirit of God as sons are to have anything to do with that part of the battle, and I read that and I’m humbled. How in the world could I have been dragged in or weak enough to respond, react to that injustice when I know that God has everything in his care and that in his kingdom he’ll overrule it? Thank you, Brett.

Tom, I think Brett is being too hard on himself. I think it’s perfectly fine to have an opinion, especially when you see a gross immorality or some flagrant statement that a politician makes. We should be angry at that. I think Jesus got angry at the scribes and the Pharisees when they said something hypocritical.

What was I going to say now? I lost my thought.

Come back to me. But I just wanted to react to that.

There’s nothing wrong with having an opinion when there’s something that’s said or done wrongly. I think. Oh, I know, I remember. Sorry. You were asking about brethren having different opposing views.

You know, what we have in common is our knowledge of the truth. But we bring our own personalities to that. Some of us are inclined to say every jot and tittle of the rules must be obeyed and there’s no variation. They’re going to have a political opinion. When a controversial issue comes up.

Other brethren are naturally disposed. Okay, you’re right about that. But there’s room for compassion. Let’s be compassionate. In this case, the other view would say, no, no, the rule has to come first.

So we do bring our natural disposition into our lives, even when we come into the truth, and I think that’s difficult to overcome. When I heard brethren demand that every illegal alien be deported, I react against that because there’s no room for compassion in that statement. So you see automatically there’s different sides to a political opinion. So I think that’s what happens amongst our fellowship.

Yeah. So when you have. If you have. Since you have microphone, I will ask you this. Would you have any thoughts about young people?

How young people among us get those opinions? Is it coming from home? Is it coming from their environment?

Can we say anything about that? I think it comes from everywhere. The news media, which depending on which news media you listen to, is very slanted. So I think they have the same problem we have, that we bring our natural disposition, and even the way we’re raised, if we’re raised in a more liberal, merciful home, our children are going to tend to be that way.

We’re raised in a very strict. That demands the rules. The children are going to tend to be that way. As well. But everyone.

Free moral agency is not always so free. It is judged and controlled by outside influences, and I think each of us has to be careful to weigh it against godly principles. Okay, I saw Brother Jack and Brother Chuck. Yeah, I agree with Brother Tom.

In fact, he said some of the things that I would have said. But, you know, we live in this world, and there’s a work environment, there’s a school environment, there’s a society that’s governed by individuals that have different thoughts than brethren have, and we can see when there’s weaknesses in character because of what we espouse, as, you know, for humility and goodness and all this, and we are involved in that. We’re involved with other human beings in our lives.

And so you may go to work and have individuals that stand very staunchly for a particular political position that you just can’t agree with, and it causes consternation or frustration and so forth, and you may, you know, you have a negative feeling toward those people. Now, when brethren do this, when brethren take a strong position on a particular. Particular item that you may not agree with, then it does cause. Can cause conflict.

It can cause emotional distress, if you will, and so, you know, as we said, it’s best to remain neutral in looking at these particular positions because it’s in our face every day. It’s on the news. It’s, you know, and even brethren are divided as to who might be a. Have a better solution than the other side, and it may not agree with us.

And so it’s very difficult, and to remain neutral is probably the best advice, I’d say. Okay, thank you very much. You have Michael there. Oh, let’s keep this one on this table.

We have made reference to the words of Paul in 2nd Corinthians 5:20, saying, now then, we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us and pray you in Christ’s stead that you be reconciled to God, and of course, our overall mission, which is talked about in this set of verses in Second Corinthians, is to try to bring knowledge and reconciling to the world, and that is something that involves first having a good grasp of what the principles of the kingdom are and a good listening skill, because, you know, when people have a strong position in opposition to the position you’re holding, it’s not coming out of thin air. You know, there’s reasons that this has been crystallized in their thinking, and so you have to work on that in terms of the politics of this world.

I’ve had quite a tutorial. You know, I used to have to travel to our nation’s capital twice a month, did it in a one day trip each time, and got a good exposure to the different branches of our government in that process, as well as internationally. I think some of you know that I worked with the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change, which was like, are we going to be able to take care of this massive problem that is facing humanity? And of course, you know that it’ll be done in the kingdom, but it’s sort of like, oh, this will be interesting to see what’s going on, and indeed, it was interesting to watch the perspectives across the different world governments.

And as I, you know, read about the difficulties that are occurring, I could start to, you know, weep for the planet Earth. But actually the Lord is going to take care of that and I’m comfortable with that. But, you know, this is bizarre. I had a sister who has absolutely zero credentials in science call me up and try to pick a fight with me over the phone because Bill Gates doesn’t think climate change is that serious. It’s like, well, you know, Bill Gates may not have the background in the area.

And this flows amongst the brethren. I’ve heard some of the Romanian brethren believe that it’s something being done by the first world to try to keep the third world countries, the less developed countries, in a poor position, which is absolutely not the case, and I’m just talking about that because I have credentials in this area. I have attended meetings with State Department authorization three times, international meetings as the U.S. representative, and of course, my first reaction is, if this is the best the US can do, you know, we’ve got even more problems than I thought.

But leaving that aside, I actually did exactly the job that I wanted to do in life. How many of us can claim that? I was pulling together the program at one of our major national laboratories, multidisciplinary. I loved it, and I was organizing everything that could be done to try to address the climate change problem until the day that the Supreme Court declared that those 300 hanging chads in Florida gave the election to Mr. Bush instead of Mr. Gore, you know, and then I was relieved of that position as an environmental extremist.

And it’s like, you know, it may have been one of the nicest things the associate lab director ever said about me, but, you know, brethren have to listen and recognize a couple things. We are all related across the world to each other. We are being brought together, and whether we like it or not, we are going to be trying to work at reconciling the world to Christ, and I can tell you, the world is not even close to getting reconciled to Christ right now, and that is going to be our job.

So it’s going to take time, patience, and education and individuals who have the skill to know how to deal with those who haven’t had the favors. Haven’t had the favor and the blessing that we’ve had here in the United States. States, and I’ll just kind of take and drop off on this long mini discourse at this point, except just to give you an example of what you need to know to get a sense of the problems that the world faces. As we know, there were tariffs that had been imposed by the actions of Mr. Trump.

And in response to those tariffs on China, the Chinese said, hey, all those soybeans we’ve been buying to feed our livestock, especially our pork, they love pork over there. We’re not buying anymore. Which meant that the soybean market collapsed in the US and the farmers who raised soybeans, which includes Illinois, had no good place to sell those soybeans, and you could see there’s a $12 billion package of regulatory, not regulatory, but of relief for farmers that’s going to go through Congress. Now, what happened in response?

Well, it has resulted in even greater, totally inane deforestation in Brazil, the burning down of the rainforest, the cutting and burning of the rainforest to raise soybeans to export to China. Okay, that’s one of the goofy things that happens. It’s at every, from every standpoint, a bad, a bad decision, and we’re going to have to, you know, work with those kind of problems in a very practical way if we are going to be part of the bright class of Christ helping to restore this world. But, you know, these, the way in which you push on one part of the system and there’s a reaction, another part is the kind of perspective we need to develop.

Most of us just, you know, hear the jabbering on the talking heads on the social media because we’re not even watching tv, we’re picking it up on the Internet. So those are some of the comments I wanted to share. Thank you. Okay, thank you, Brother Johnson.

Just very quick, Romans 13:1 2. Let every soul be in subjection to the higher authorities. For there is no power but of God, and the authorities that are be ordained by God. Therefore, he that resists the authority withstands the ordinance of God, and they that withstand shall receive to themselves condemnation. I think we are Very blessed to be able to have what we have.

Every form of government is better than anarchy, Brother Asl says, and the nation of Israel was ordained and told them that. Seek the peace and the prosperity of the city to which I carried you into exile. Brother Russell, in reprint 1553. The Spirit of submission rather than of contention is enjoyed upon the whole church.

I think we should. When we hear people complaining or saying things, we should be the first ones to be peacemakers. Maybe use that to direct toward the kingdom and to be examples how to be thankful for what we have and direct to a better kingdom and better government that we are looking for. Okay, thank you.

I want to build. Sorry for talking so much. I want to build on something John just said and it relates to the second part of your question. Number one. Can we offer advice on what to do if we witness or become involved in one of the emotional discussions about the political situation?

Thank you. I wanted to say in our country, so I’m a good straight man for you.

I learned a technique from Brother Dan Larson many years ago, and whenever he got caught up in a conversation that somebody wanted to provoke him to take a side and argue or whatever, Brother Dan Larson would simply say, that’s why the world needs the kingdom, and he wouldn’t argue which side was right or wrong, because both sides are wrong. Whatever one side can say about the other side and how bad they are is probably true. Both sides are corrupt, unjust and unrighteousness.

Neither side is going to fix the world’s ills or even make it a little better, and that’s why the world needs the kingdom. Kingdom. Now, in our Thursday study just a few days ago, we had a lesson on how Brother Russell sympathized. He used that word many times.

The efforts of organizations and groups in his day to make the world a better place. He said, we sympathize with the Salvation army, and he listed a bunch of others that I think disappeared a long time ago. But the point was we sympathize with them, but we don’t get involved with or support them with our time and efforts because we have a higher calling. I just want to add this, my observation on the world today and why I stay away from it.

It may sound like a cop out. It may seem like, joe, you know, you’re just not facing reality. You’re burying your head in the sand. Well, I don’t think so, and here’s my observation.

You know, I’m old enough to have witnessed a regrettable decline in the political discourse between Government leaders in the years that I’ve been on earth, when I was young, politicians disagreed with each other, but they simply regarded their opponents as honorable but misguided, and they struck a compromise, and politics worked the way it should. Later on, the political discourse degraded to the point where each side regarded the other as not just honorable and misguided, but wrong, and yet they still struck a compromise, unimportant legislation.

Fast Forward to maybe 10 years ago or so, and the political discourse declined to the level where each side declared each other such evil haters of America and its values that no compromise was any more possible, and it’s gotten even worse to today where each side wants to destroy each other, so there is no opposing side left standing. They’re either in jail or in a prison in El Salvador, and so this has led to so much misinformation, disinformation, the death of truth, and the end of free speech. Why would we not get involved with any of that?

So I don’t think it’s hiding my head in the sand is simply say, I’m not going to talk to you about the specifics of your argument. That’s why the world needs the kingdom. In closing, there was a comment, Brother Russell, well said. I think it’s in the context of that fourth volume quote that was read earlier. Let the world fight its battles.

Okay, thank you. Yes. So I, I very like this progression that Rajo explained to us that right now each side tries to destroy each other. There’s no place for compromise, and if we are kind of getting involved in that, I guess we can very easily get into this rhetoric, in this thinking and in thinking that other sides is so bad that there is nothing good in that.

So anybody else would have advice. If you see that brethren are involved in discussion, or maybe we by chance got involved and discussion got quite emotional, what do we do? Brother Jack?

Yeah, I think that’s where you were heading, that when two brethren or two of the brethren have opposition, you know, do we have any advice for that? So I look into the Scriptures to see if we had scriptures that might help along those lines, and I have Proverbs 23, it is an honor for a man to cease from strife, but every fool will be meddling, and, you know, the comment there is, walking away from a heated argument is honorable. You don’t have to, you know, fight.

And I have James 3:16. For where envying and strife is, there is confusion and evil work. So emotional debates can cause frustration, can cause confusion when emotions arise.

We should understand that the political systems are temporary, and we have a couple scriptures there. Philippians 3, verse 20. For our citizenship is in heaven. Heaven. John 18:36.

My kingdom is not of this world. We agree with that. So this helps us resist in becoming too involved in political outcomes when we think along those lines, and then we have Romans 14:1. Now accept the one who is weak in faith, but not to have quarrels over opinions.

That’s from the numerical standard in Romans 14:13. Let us not therefore judge one another anymore. So when you argue politics, there is a judgment that’s taking place, and you know, you have feelings for your side, but you want to have kind of mercy for the. For the other side.

And I’m just looking at scripture that tries to even this out, if you will, and then when emotions rise within ourselves, Ecclesiastes 7:9.

Do not be eager in your spirit to be angry, for anger resides in the heart of fools. In James 1, 1920, could every man be swift to hear, slow to speak, slow to wrath? For the wrath of man worketh not the righteousness of God. It’s easy to sit here and talk about, you know, these principles, but it’s difficult to put, you know, sometimes scripture into action because we’re human and we have these emotions, and it does affect us when it goes against what we strongly believe, and brother Brett made a good comment.

You know, Trump will say something, or Brother Tom about putting the immigrants. Thank you. Into jail. You know, we may take a side on that that’s so strong that it’s very difficult to keep our emotions in check. So I think if we rely on scripture, it helps us quite a bit.

Okay, thank you very, Tom. I think we have realized for many years that democracy is the best system man has ever come up with. But the blessing of what is happening with the degrading of democracy is that when the kingdom is established and true justice and wise decisions are made, Americans are going to say, oh, this is so much better. So this contrast, as painful as it is to watch what’s happening, is absolutely necessary in the permission of evil. Okay, but any other advice?

What to do if we witness such emotional discussion or we somehow got into discussion and it is emotional, This is maybe just practical. I dealt with a lot of difficult HR situations in my job, and one thing, and this is human wisdom, but I think it’s based in God’s character. One thing it’s really important to do is separate facts from opinion from emotion, and when you’re in an emotional discussion, you’ve lost control of opinion.

In fact, when you’re in an opinionated discussion, you’ve lost control of fact because you’ve now applied your biases and so is your debater, and now today, going back to Brother Joe’s point, what is truth? We don’t know what the facts are anymore. It’s really hard to actually have any grounding in any of these arguments. We see these things in front of us and we think they’re true, or we think that we understand the story and we really don’t.

So we have to trust the Lord and trust him to help us, maybe in this situation, help the conversation walk back a little bit. Somebody makes a statement that’s emotional, don’t let it affect us. Respect that. It’s an emotional moment, and sometimes our emotions will cause us to say things we don’t really mean or don’t really even understand.

When we’re in an opinionated discussion, and those are the best debates, we might disagree, but we can never let it get up, and we always have to have those opinions based in what we see as facts, and for me, and I think for everybody at this table, the facts are in the Scriptures, and those are really the only facts that we can count on, other than those things that God has taught all humans in terms of his character, the understanding of right and wrong that was innately put into us, and the idea that we would respect one another because we are all God’s creation. Yeah, this is very true, and I think one of the problem is that we are not able to quickly find out what facts are, what the truth is, because we rely on opinions of others.

There is no way that we can spend that much time to get to the source of information and find out. Sometimes we don’t have a way of accessing the sources of information and to really find out what the true facts are. For example, let’s say Social Security, there is a discussion about that, how to save it, and both political parties have maybe different opinions, but facts are in the numbers, and nobody gives real numbers. It’s just your opinion how to save it.

If we want to really get to the issue, we have to have some economical basis and get to the numbers and find out how economically this could be saved.

Oh, brother Christy. Sorry, brother Christy.

You are still muted. Yeah. Can you hear me, Brother Barek? Yes. Can you hear me?

Yes.

So to your question, I think we have a precedent in principle. It’s in Corinthians when Apostle Peter, Apostle Paul, excuse me, Apostle Paul speaks about different groups. One was Cephas, one Was Apollos one? Was Paul, what he does in that, rather than going into the details as all the brethren were saying, he goes back to the basic fact, who died for you and in whose name you have been baptized. Take that side.

I think is the same with us. I was involved in a few discussions actually with some brethren in Europe, and I said, who did we all vote that we will be like?

And we all agree that we were promising the Lord that will be Christlike. So let’s focus on that rather than identifying ourselves with a person or with a position or with a political party. Secondly, I think most of the conflicts comes from the fact that maybe we are not clearly enough in expressing the fact that. That our Lord Jesus really expressed. If you remember in John 14, verse 30, he says, the ruler of this world is coming, and he has nothing in me.

If the Lord Jesus Christ says that the ruler of this world, which is Satan, has nothing in him, why do we want to have a little something? I think we want to have as much in us as possible. Why does he not have anything in him is because he is moved by pride, and if you look and anything, any conflict that I personally had in regard to any matters, it’s because of my personal pride. At the bottom, bottom root is the pride.

It might be just the pride to be right, but many other things, and that was one of the shocking elements that both me and Sister Lily, when we came to America, when we interview for jobs in our fields, in IT and in medicine, one of the main questions at the interview was, what are you proud of in regards to yourself? So you can see, and I think everyone can testify, this world is built on being proud is really built on proud and profit. The kingdom that Jesus brings and the rules that we look into the spiritual world are based on humility and unsuccessful in the eyes of the world. So it’s so incompatible that would be unwise to spend minutes, hours, days, sometimes nights in following and looking over and over again through these things.

Of course we want the kingdom, we desire the kingdom, but we know that the kingdom of Jesus is not of this world over. Yes. Thank you. Thank you, Brother Christie. Last question on this topic.

Can we imagine a situation that we get to this. Well, this situation that somebody is so involved, so destructive in their comments that we have to react, we have to say, no more. I don’t want to see you anymore. I don’t want to talk to you anymore, because what you do is wrong. Do you think that we can find ourselves in situation like that?

And what we should do in this case.

Maybe we are not on this level yet, brethren. Yeah, Brett? Well, I can only think of the examples that I’ve seen.

And, you know, occasionally you’ll see somebody express an opinion, whether it be in email or online, in person, in front of others, or even on social media, and I’ve seen some other brethren set a good example when it seems to be a topic irrelevant to our Christianity that someone’s commenting on, and they’ll basically say, just take me off the list, and that’s a statement that says, I don’t want to be a part of this. It’s not condemning of the other person. It’s not meant to condemn the other person.

It’s just stating that for me, this isn’t something I choose to be a participant in, and hopefully the one that, you know, submits this is not necessarily hurt by that, but maybe has a cause to pause and think, why would somebody not want to be a part of this? Maybe there’s something I can do differently or think about differently, but that’s the only thing I can come up with, Brother Dark. You know, I think sometimes we have to respect that there may be background and context for everything that our brethren do that we don’t understand and haven’t seen. So if they’re in a personal situation with us, then we can ask them and we can try to get to the bottom of it and understand them, even if maybe the appearance of it to us isn’t something that we would necessarily do.

Okay, thank you. Anybody else?

Well, I would say if you’re talking to someone in person, you can change the subject, and if you have the truth in common, that should be an easy thing to do. So I would. Sometimes we’re hesitant to interrupt someone’s train of thought, but I think it could be done gently enough where it’s not. Obviously, I hate what you’re saying, so we’re going to talk about this.

I think it could be done kindly and gently, where you bring up a question. You know, in our study last Thursday, we were talking about this. What do you think? And I think that’s the way to do it with brethren. You can’t do that.

With the world. Obviously with the world, you can change the subject, but it may not be a true subject. I think you can help direct a discussion better, and maybe that person will get the message that there’s something more important to speak about. Okay. All right, Chris?

Yeah, I think it’s definitely difficult, depending on our interpersonal skills and abilities, to enter into a conversation Perhaps confront someone about their practice or their behavior. But I think from a more intellectual perspective, I kind of noted out with some help of the modern tools about what Brother Russell would have answered to your question. Why we get sometimes involved, and here are just some high level points, perhaps, perhaps that would be a good. These could be good inputs in feedback that we offer to someone whose behavior or messaging we see is not ideal.

So misunderstanding of the divine plan, confusion of kingdom work with reform, and failure to wait on God to take his steps and actually wanting to act right now sometimes there may be, you know, our fear and opposition to chaos, and if we see an authoritative representation, we tend to gravitate to it. Well, would that be to the extent that we want to get personally involved in it or just simply that we have an emotional preference or just simply orderly preference in our character and that we would want to combat anarchy? Now we ourselves are just simply that we prefer to have order, that we have a sympathy and sense of justice. Obviously we are principled, as was mentioned, and we may have a reaction to oppression, we may want to seek the moral reform, but as we’ve said, these things will not succeed in the current time.

And so therefore our extent of that involvement would have to be measured, and also we may have kind of a self interest in a certain idea to be successful. Maybe we have some financial or social preservation in mind and would like for that direction to actually succeed for us. Well, we know that this world is not going to be growing into this prosperous end, but rather we are seeing that the prosperity will be brought about by the kingdom, which is a different government and different world, and there could be deception that we might be susceptible to, and finally, consequences of political engagement.

If we do support a candidate, we almost have like this moral responsibility for them succeeding. When they don’t succeed, suddenly we become, you know, we are trepidated, we lose our peace, we say we trust it and we are disappointed. I think for a Christian to have trust it is to trust in the Lord and in his word rather than a specific line that is just, you know, running through all these different challenges and objections and sometimes uses unworthy means to achieve this. But I’ll finish on something that may actually help us go into the next phase is that as we look and discuss these different events, going back to like looking at the prophetic developments, that we do want to separate, as they say today, noise from the signal. Noise is all of the, you know, emotional, all of these overtones, all these, you know, ways in which you’re trying to be influenced.

And the signal is those facts that we want to see changing. Do we see that whatever is permitted at this time, whatever, you know, influences or governmental decisions or initiatives that they somehow promote and do forward either the collective education of the world in what works and what hasn’t worked and some enlightenment and perhaps also in the direction of international affairs and Israel and things that, you know, would progress God’s plan in that direction, and I think if we do see that, we should not totally close our eyes and say, oh, this is just coincidental, but we want to see, aha, the Lord is permitting this, allowing this, perhaps blessing this direction, regardless of what the exact agent of that change is, but rather where this is going. Thank you, Brother Chris, and that’s a good prompt that we should change the topic because we don’t have enough time for next topic.

And the next topic is Israel in God’s eyes right now, world is divided in opinion about Israel, about events in Israel, about military actions of Israel right now, and I’m not sure if you see what happens in Europe and if you know about Eurovision. Israel was included in Eurovision Conquers, how is it called?

I’m not sure who else. Yeah, and two countries said that they would not participate because of Israel was allowed to be part of Eurovision. Those two countries say they will not participate. So that’s how it is in Europe around the world.

It’s again polarized situation that some countries are for and some countries are against Israel. They see it that what Israel does is not good right now, so they cannot support it. In our position, we want to support Israel because we see that Israel is important part, part of the God’s plan, God’s kingdom coming to the earth. But I think it’s not clear to what extent and how we should support Israel, and I was thinking, well, people judged Israel by events, but maybe by kind of biases that they already have.

Now, if we want to recognize what’s happening in Israel right now, I think we should kind of look beyond events unwere and ask, well, how God himself looks at the situation Israel.

Does he approve that? Or is not everything what is happening in Israel is according to his will? And I would start with a question about.

Kind of legal situation of Israel. Do we know how God would judge or according to what rules this judgment would be or God would judge events that happens right now in Israel. Would we say that Israel is still under the old covenant or would we say that the covenant ended and what we have today is completely different legal situation than before? And because we don’t know according to what rules God considers events in Israel. We don’t know really what to say.

Any thoughts about that, Brother John?

Just to start the conversation about this, I put some scriptures on the screen. Maybe we think of all these verses, the law as a garden until where it says that the law was added for the transgression of the seed, until the promise comes, for the kingdom of God is taken away, your house is left unto you desolate. Or when we read that Jesus nailed the lot of the cross, so maybe our first thought comes that the law ended and now it’s a different arrangement. But we know that the nation of Israel has a special God deals with them in a special way, and the key verse is in Romans 10:4, where Apostle Paul said, for Christ is the end of the law for righteousness for everyone who believes.

So I think that is the key for everyone who believes under that arrangement under the Mosaic Law, they can come out of it. Otherwise, brother Russell in Volume 6, page 379, thus making a full end of it or of the law as respected himself and as respected all the Jews coming unto the Father through him. All Jews have not accepted Christ, are still bound by every provision and regulation of their law covenant, and as the Apostle explained, they can get free from it by accepting Christ in the end of the law, and there is one more I won’t read it from question and answers exactly in the same direction that Brother ASO says, that he did not end at the cross and it has not ended and it will be the new covenant that will.

That will end that. Now this is just in a strictly and theoretical way, right? I’m sure, Brother Darek, you want more specific. What does that mean in a practical way that the nation of Israel is under that law? Is God accepting certain actions or not?

Or how? What does that mean if they are still under the law? So I let other elders continue from here if they agree with this start of the conversation. Okay, Joe, I’m looking at the wording of your question as you gave it to us. Is Israel still under the Old covenant and the Mosaic Law law, or is it no longer under a covenant?

I’ll give you four answers. One is my own. The other three come from Brother Russell. My answer to the question, is Israel still under the old covenant is no, and I have some of the scriptures that John also cited.

I won’t read any of them, but here’s my answer. We see illustrated on the chart of the ages the ending of the law covenant as a way to peace with God through typical justification as the result of the animal sacrifices, and that’s shown right across at the end of plane P, which marks the end of that plane as John just described. So that’s my answer. But it is important to distinguish between the law covenant and the law that is God’s law given to Moses.

And so we often call it the Mosaic Law. While the law covenant ended, as I just said, the law, God’s law, God’s standard of righteousness is eternal. It never ends, and Brother Russell put it this way. So here’s where you’re going to get brother Russell’s three answers to this question from question book page 431.

Question book page 431. The question is, when did Jesus put an end to the law? At Jordan or at Calvary?

This expression putting an end to the law is one that is apt to be misunderstood. The question might be viewed from various viewpoints. Jesus never put an end to the law in a very important sense of the word. The law is the Father’s law. It existed before Jesus came.

It still exists. It will always be in existence. Jesus did not put an end to to it and never will put an end to it. It is God’s law. Briefly summed up in thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, with all thy soul, mind and strength, and thy neighbor as thyself.

When will that law be put to an end? Never. Never. I could just see Brother Russell saying this. You know, these were live transcripts of question sessions.

We get a little nearer to an appreciation of it every day. Neither at the Jordan or at Cannon Calvary, nor at any time will he ever put an end to that law. What then is meant by this expression? Upon the basis of that law, as God gave it through Moses to the Israelites was made a covenant, and that covenant was often called the law because it was the law covenant.

And consequently this word covenant sometimes is used when the law is meant and the word law was used to include the covenant based upon it. It was in this sense that Jesus made an end of the law, that is the law covenant or the covenant based upon that law. He made an end of this covenant. Now I should stop there, but I’ll keep reading because here’s where Brother Russell gives a head spinning third answer to the two part question, and yet Brother Russell continues.

He did not make a full end of the law covenant even for to my understanding, the Jews are still under that law covenant and certain blessings are to come to them in consequence they are now under the condemnation part of that law covenant. But if it were dead, they would not be under its condemnation phase. They could not be under the condemnation of a dead covenant. Jesus therefore made an end simply of the favors, privileges, opportunities granted to the Jews under that covenant. End of quote.

So I’ll close with this. I often say when discussing controversial terms like sin offering or rain or restitution, it is incumbent upon us to define the terms terms as we are using them and see if there’s any difference in what others we are talking to have in their mind as a definition of those terms, and so in discussing the law and the law covenant, which are different, we have to define those terms every under as we understand them. So as a last comment, I’ll take my own advice that I just said and define what I mean when I talk about the law covenant and whether or not Israel is still under it or not. I’ll repeat what I said when I began my answer.

We see illustrated in the chart of the ages the ending of the law covenant as the way to peace with God through typical justification as the result of animal sacrifices shown by the cross on plane P which marks the end of that plane.

Thank you. I think it’s very important what you said that read from quote, that Israel is under condemnation of this law, of this covenant. But it was written before 1948, before 1914, and we believe that this condemnation ended. So now the question is, what now? Because covenant ended, condemnation ended.

So what is the arrangement right now, Brother Richard and Brother Tom? Well, to get things started, we need to look at prophecy and look at it as it’s operating in the present day. We are told that all of Israel’s lovers will forsake her, and as the saying goes, what part of all isn’t clear? So we know that there’s going to continue to be an alienation.

And what’s happened since the attack on Israel October 7th is that as divided and polarized as they are underneath, they have come together against a common foe.

At the same time, we can see that the governments of this world, the general sense of the populace of the governments of this world has become far less sympathetic. In fact, actually in antipathy to Israel. That’s what prophecy told us to look for. So we’re seeing it. Of course, we want to hold forth our belief in the promises to Israel and be cautious about the effectiveness of the media in terms of manipulating public opinion.

Unless it was a fabricated photo.

The Jerusalem Post this last week showed a warehouse in Gaza that was packed nearly to the ceiling with bundles of baby food.

And there was a. The argument that the Jerusalem Post is making is that this was food that was to be delivered for humanitarian assistance in Gaza, but it was being withheld. Why? There is nothing that creates sympathy more than to see the pictures of the starving babies. I don’t like seeing the pictures of the starving babies.

However, the leadership of the Palestinians really is concerned about winning the war of public opinion, and if that means there are pictures of starving babies, that’s what will happen. Now, possibly, you know, all of that is a manipulation and something that the Jerusalem Post put together. But my observation is that the Palestinians have been exceedingly clever at knowing how to manipulate public opinion, beginning a war that they knew they couldn’t possibly win, but they knew they would win the war of changing world opinion.

And they knew Bibi was the right one to not back down. You know, Mr. Netanyahu was not going to back down because this time he was going to say, we don’t care if their control center is in a hospital or school, bomb it. So prophecy needs to be well focused on in our thinking, and I’ve been pleased to see that the Brethren have had a lot of discussions on Ezekiel 38 and 39. They still haven’t gotten it right, but that’s okay.

They’re in the right direction, and this is, you know, your opinion is being manipulated at every level. So be careful.

Yes. So the same thing with the question we had before, that truth dies first in all those conflicts, and especially here, it’s hard to find out the truth. Okay, Brother Tom, but maybe one comment before, because I just want to kind of say what was my intention under this question. So from the history, we know that God is patient, but reacts to evil, to something that happens. What is wrong in Israel?

If we say that everything what’s going on right now in Israel is accepted by God and nothing major as far as something against him, then we can expect that Israel will smoothly transition to the Kingdom. Maybe just some corrections and that’s it. You are good. If the judgment of Israel by God right now is negative, meaning that he doesn’t accept what’s going on according to his rules, then we can expect that that would be corrected and correction could be quite dramatic. So the answer to this question kind of give us answer what will happen next?

What can we expect in the future? Brother Tan, I was going to comment on Brother Joe’s summary. I think Galatians 3:19, talking about the end of the law. It says it’s comparing the Abrahamic covenant with the law, and he says, why then the law, it was added because of transgression, until the seed should come to whom the promise was made.

So the ceremonial feature of the law ended at the cross, but the moral feature continues, and I think that’s what Brother Russell’s comment was. I mean, what part of the Mosaic Law, the Ten Commandments, would you say ended? You shall not take the name of the Lord God in vain. You shall not murder.

I mean, those are moral principles that will always continue. As Brother Joe mentioned, to answer your question, there is a great correction coming for Israel. Scriptures are clear. Ezekiel 20 talks about the purging of the rebels of Israel. Isaiah 1:25 says, I will purely purge away the dross.

I think what’s happening is, and what’s going to happen, and maybe this relates to what’s happening in Gaza, is that we don’t know the full extent of what’s happening in Israel. We just hear the news media, and lately the news media has been slanted against Israel because many children have died and innocent people. I think Israel had a right to do what they did. They had a right to go in and defend themselves because Hamas attacked them.

Hamas built tunnels under hospitals. Well, is Israel supposed to leave those tunnels there? Hamas never signed a peace agreement. Hamas continues to want to destroy Israel. So Israel has to be in a position to defend themselves and try to eliminate Hamas.

But having said that, have they gone to extremes where they could have not hurt innocent people? We don’t know those things, and I think there are indications that Israel tends to go to extremes sometimes and that there are this idea of rebels, that they are not trying necessarily to follow God’s laws, God’s principles. They are doing what they think is necessary to preserve themselves. So we cannot be 100% supportive of what Israel does.

I think our attitude has to be, this is all in the Lord’s hand. He will take care of it. He will purge the rebels. We are not smart enough to make those judgments. Okay, thank you, Brother Brad and Brother Jack.

Just real quick. Zephaniah has beautiful prophecy that has, I think, symbolic application in a much greater sense to a lot of what’s going on at the end of the age. But in chapter two, it talks about basically the Lord overcoming all the enemies of Judah and the restoration of the remnant, and then chapter three talks about the introduction of the kingdom, and in chapter three in particular, verse.

Let’s see. I think it’s verse 11, and this is speaking, you know, to Israel broadly in that day you will feel no shame because of all your deeds by which you’ve rebelled against me. For then I will remove from your midst your proud exalting ones, and you will never again be haughty. On my holy mountain I will leave you a humble and lowly people, and they will take refuge in the name of the Lord.

And, and of course, you have the. The purified lips or language earlier on in that. In that sequence of verses, and so I think there’s a process here that’s occurring.

The zeal of God is accomplishing what’s going on in Israel today. Is Israel prepared fully for the outcomes? Not yet, but they will be. It’s still secular. Israel is still largely secular, secular.

No matter what the religion or the uprising of religion seems to be, and the signs that we see there, they’ve not yet come to the point of recognizing God as doing all of these things for them and following completely after Him. Of course, we have much more, as Brother Richard pointed out about Ezekiel 38 that is coming. So there’s more to occur and more to happen in his room. Jack, I appreciate that.

What Brother Brook said, your question exactly was, are there any scriptures that could help us understand the basis of God’s judgment of Israel today? And I had two acts, 10, 34 and 35, and Peter opened his mouth and said, in truth, I perceive that God shows no partiality but in every nation. Whoever fears him and works righteousness is accepted by Him. I think this shows that Israel must turn to God and reverence him, obey him all the righteous principles.

And this will occur sometime, I believe, when God fights for Israel, like in the days of old. I don’t think it’s happening now necessarily. It seems that there’s more trust in weapons, alliances and strategy rather than turning to God for his favor. The second scripture is Jeremiah 18:5,10. It says, Then the word of the Lord came to me saying, O house of Israel, can I not do with you as this potter says the Lord?

Look, as the clay is in the potter’s hand, so are you in my hand, O house of Israel. The instant I speak concerning a nation and concerning a kingdom, to pluck up, to pull down, and to destroy it. If that nation against whom I have spoken turns from its evil, I will relent of the disaster that I thought to bring upon it, and the instant I speak concerning a nation and concerning a kingdom to build and to plant it. If it does evil in my sight, so that it does not obey my voice, then I will relent concerning the Good.

With which I said I would benefit, and once again, it’s a principle that God’s putting forth. It’s to obey and receive the blessings, and the fact that Israel is adamant in maintaining its land, keeping it holding it shows that there’s a principle there that, you know, that falls under, under this guidance, there’s not going to be a political resolution of this. It’s going to be through God’s way and God’s plan.

So supporting the land I think is very, very important. Whether they’re doing it based on scripture and righteousness or whether it’s because of it’s my land, it’s my pride and so forth and so on, I can’t say. But eventually, as was mentioned, what is going to be coming through Ezekiel 38 and so forth, Psalm 83, that it shows that there will be a change in Israel’s heart to turn to God and want his direction and influence in their life. Thank you.

I think it’s very difficult to get to conclusion. What are actual laws that God uses to judge Israel right now we agree that there is a universal law. But one of the commandments I think was, you will not have unbeliever amongst you if we would like to use this law today and say that this is how Israel is judged right now. We know that Israel is very diverse right now and there are those who are atheists and other religions. So how can we say that?

Well, that’s one of the commandments that Israel will be judged by, and so I think the rule changed. But we don’t know exactly how to define that because I don’t think that all rules, all laws of all covenant are in play right now because otherwise Israel would, I don’t know, be condemned again because they don’t keep those laws as far as the whole nations. So this is why the answer is so difficult. Okay, I’m looking at my watch and we don’t have any time.

I’m sorry, we had more questions. There were, I had a question about the neighbors of Israel because sometimes we think that Israel should kind of apply Old Testament rules where he was given land and he should remove all nations from this land. So we, we tend to think that oh, maybe this rule still applies today. But other hand, Israel signed or is under the international agreement. Oslo is the most known, I think that divides who has what land.

And question is, I think both sides kind of use this tactic, tactic that this is human law and we have our own internal law. So we will not keep it, and this is why we have the problem and the question is, what is God’s view on it? If they agree, should they keep it? Or are they allowed to basically break the law and do according to what they perceive is proper conduct in this situation?

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