Panel Questions on David – Part 2 – John B, Bill D, Tom R, David S.

This transcript was generated automatically. Its accuracy may vary

Short Summary

The discussion covered several topics including reasons for losing heart in faith and ways to prevent it, emphasizing the importance of personal fellowship, active service, and mutual care among brethren. It also explored David’s multifaceted role as king, prophet, and patriarch, highlighting his character through biblical accounts such as his battle with the Amalekites and his generosity. Additionally, the elders shared personal testimonies of spiritual milestones, reflected on favorite Psalms for encouragement, addressed the issue of idolatry during David’s reign, and contemplated David’s anticipated role in the mediatorial kingdom as a shepherd-king who will actively guide and support the people.

Long Summary

Here is a detailed bullet-point summary of the question meeting discussion you provided, including Bible references mentioned:

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### Question 6: What causes us to lose heart for God, and how can we prevent it?

Challenges to spiritual zeal:
– Loneliness, discouragement, and decreased fellowship can cause believers to lose heart.
– COVID-19 led to reliance on Zoom meetings, which, while helpful, lack the full personal interaction of face-to-face meetings.
– Some brethren may attend online meetings passively (“just putting in their time”) without engaging fully.

Importance of personal connection:
– Face-to-face meetings allow for fuller communication, including facial expressions and physical presence (hugging, feeling).
– Personal contact helps maintain spiritual health and prevents being “swept away by the world.”
– Everyone—not just elders—has a responsibility to watch over and care for one another (1 Corinthians 12:25: “that there should be no schism in the body; but that the members should have the same care one for another”).
– Sisters connecting with sisters is a natural way to encourage each other.

Practical steps to prevent losing heart:
– Spending time with brethren during vacations or social activities.
– Being involved in physical service for the Lord, which reminds us of our purpose: serving the King of the universe and preparing for the kingdom.
– Remembering the noble cause motivates sacrifice and perseverance.

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### Question 7: Why was David referred to as a prophet when he was actually a king? (Acts 2:29-31)

– Peter calls David a “prophet” because David foresaw and prophesied about the resurrection of Christ (quoting Psalm 16:10).
– David’s writings (Psalms) are filled with prophecy, e.g., Psalm 22 (Christ’s sacrifice), Psalm 2 (the heathen raging).
– David was multifaceted: a king, prophet, and patriarch.
– 2 Peter 1:21 emphasizes prophecy as inspired by the Holy Spirit.
– Other figures (e.g., Samuel) also held multiple roles such as prophet and judge.
– Psalms like 145 and 37 have prophetic significance related to the kingdom and the destruction of evil.

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### Question 8: Sharing personal Ebenezers (stones of help)

Brother Tom’s Ebenezer:
– Early experience with colporting and desire to serve the Lord more fully.
– Business venture with his father allowed part-time work and more time for service.
– Importance of a supportive spouse sharing the vision.

Brother John’s Ebenezer:
– Flexibility in travel plans led to blessings, such as attending immersion events in France with 80 brethren.
– Having a supportive wife is crucial for fruitful service and fellowship.

Brother David’s Ebenezer:
– Experience of ministering to widows and learning to listen patiently.
– Realizing the blessing of being a good listener to those in need of encouragement.

Brother Bill’s Ebenezer:
– Mission to encourage Romanian brethren to attend a convention despite past hardships.
– Received anonymous financial help after deciding to go—a clear “kiss from the Heavenly Father.”
– Emphasizes how stepping out in faith invites divine support.

– Biblical reference: 1 Samuel 7 (Ebenezer stone raised after victory) shows how past defeats can become markers of divine help and victory.

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### Question 9: Favorite Psalm of David and why

– Psalms can be personal and change over time, reflecting life’s seasons.
Psalm 51: Known for repentance and humility; relevant for personal reflection on sin and forgiveness.
Psalm 27:1,4: “The Lord is my light and my salvation; whom shall I fear?” Emphasizes desire to dwell in God’s presence and inquire in His temple.
Psalm 145: Prophetic about the kingdom, uplifting when discouraged by world events.
Psalm 37: Encourages trust in God despite evildoers; includes Psalm 37:4-5 about delighting in Jehovah and receiving desires of the heart.
Psalm 71: Reflects lifelong faithfulness from youth to old age; inspires consistency in service.

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### Question 10: Why was 1 Samuel 30 included in David’s history? What does David’s battle with the Amalekites add?

– The story shows David’s character: generosity (sharing spoils with those who stayed behind), care for family (wives and children taken captive), leadership in crisis.
– David’s inquiry of the Lord via the ephod (Urim and Thummim) shows dependence on divine guidance.
– Possible prophetic or doctrinal symbolism: battles represent spiritual warfare and the long process of overcoming sin.
– Application: teaches lessons about leadership, justice, generosity, and restoration.
– The story emphasizes restoration and reconciliation rather than destruction (all captives rescued).
– Biblical parallels: Joshua’s battles after crossing Jordan as symbolic of kingdom conquest.
– The story highlights perseverance and faith in God’s promises.

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### Question 11: Was there idolatry in David’s reign?

– No direct biblical record of idolatry during David’s reign.
– David strongly opposed idolatry and promoted iconoclasm (destruction of idols).
– 1 Chronicles 16:26 contrasts idols with the true God: “For all the gods of the peoples are idols, but Jehovah made the heavens.”
– Possible hidden idolatry among the people, but not tolerated by David.
– Application: leadership influences the spiritual state of the people.
– Future millennial kingdom will see righteous leadership enforcing true worship.
– Idolatry is contrasted with faithfulness and obedience, a key theme in covenant relationship.

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### Question 13: David refers to God’s heart (2 Samuel 7:21, 1 Chronicles 7:20). Is this unique? What does it mean?

– David humbly recognizes God’s graciousness and loving-kindness.
– The phrase expresses God’s delight and love in doing good for His people.
– Other scriptures reflect God’s heart/love:
– Deuteronomy 7:7-8: God chose Israel out of love, not merit.
– 1 Samuel 13:14: David as a man after God’s own heart.
– Jeremiah 32:41: God rejoices in His people with heart and soul.
– Doctrinally, God’s plans flow from His character, not human worthiness.
– Emphasizes God’s love, mercy, and grace toward imperfect humans.
– We are called to humility and trust in God’s heart.
– Application: We serve because of God’s love, not our merit.

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### Question 14: What role will David have in the mediatorial kingdom?

– Scriptures (Ezekiel 34:23-24, Ezekiel 37:24-25, Jeremiah 30:9) describe David as shepherd, prince, and king over Israel in the kingdom.
– David’s experience as shepherd and king prepare him to care for people during the kingdom.
– He will likely be involved actively, touring and teaching people, not just sitting passively.
– His leadership experience and devotional nature are valuable.
– David’s imperfections (e.g., sin with Bathsheba/Uriah) will be addressed fully in the kingdom.
– David represents a pattern for Messiah (Jesus is called Son of David).
– Kingdom roles of ancient worthies include governance, teaching, and shepherding.
– The term “prince” implies regal authority delegated by God.
– Application: David will help guide and govern mankind in the millennial kingdom, assisting Christ.

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### Additional Notes and Themes

– The importance of mutual care and responsibility among brethren (1 Corinthians 12:25, Romans 12).
– The value of humility and recognizing God’s grace in all success.
– The spiritual symbolism in biblical narratives and their application to personal and future kingdom experiences.
– The ongoing battle against sin is a lengthy, challenging process requiring divine assistance and personal perseverance.
– Fellowship, service, and flexibility are key to maintaining spiritual health and effectiveness.
– God’s love and justice are central to His dealings with humanity and will be fully manifested in the kingdom.

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This summary captures the major points, doctrinal insights, practical applications, and biblical references discussed in the question meeting.

Transcript

Two left on question six. Let me repeat the question once again. What causes us to lose heart for God, and what can we do to prevent it? A few more thoughts that we want to include in this. Brother Bill, Brother David.

You know, I ended my comment, or my comment at the very end was, you know, we want to keep the water out of the boat. You know, how do we do that? I mean, since COVID we’ve had, you know, zoom meetings. It’s been very beneficial to the brethren when we really couldn’t meet face to face, and of course, that has carried on to where we are today.

And we see the Brethren decreasing. We don’t really see our numbers increasing, and so I think it’s important for us to do just what we’re doing here today. I think meeting together face to face, I think thinking about those things, spending your time, your vacation time with the Brethren, doing things together, I think those are all very important things to do, because if you don’t fill your time with that, you can be swept away with the world, and the other thing, you know, I just comment on the zoom meetings.

I am on a number of different zoom meetings, and I do join some of them. But, you know, it is a little discouraging when you do see just the black screen and the Brethren are getting into the mode where, you know, do they think they are just putting in their time and turning on the zoom meeting? I mean, and they’re maybe in their, you know, fuzzy pajamas or whatever and they’re joining the meeting, and you really, you know, our, you know, we all are kind of laughing about it, and I can see everybody’s face out there.

And that is probably what percent of percentage of our communication is me looking at you and seeing your facial expression. It’s a big part of our communication. You know, it’s not just the answers, and, you know, we’re reading, you know, the scriptures and getting an an or something like that, and, you know, that’s great and all that, but, you know, there’s. I think there’s this personal thing that we need to keep in contact with each other.

And I think that’s part. That’s a big part of keeping the water out of the boat. Very nice comment, Brother Bill. You know, when you think about communication, one level of communication is talking on the phone, right? Just using our ears.

Now, with zoom, we can see each other and hear each other. So now we get eyes and ears, but we come to a convention, oh, I can hug my brethren. I can feel them. I can see that personal Interchange. It just gets better and better.

And you know, I was thinking about this question a little bit more during the break. Losing heart. Several of you, I think Brother Tom in particular mentioned loneliness as a very difficult thing to deal with. As elders, we have a special responsibility to watch over the flock. We have to look at their spiritual health, their countenance, how are they doing?

The physical aspect of it is important as well as the spiritual aspect. But just because that’s a heavy responsibility on elders, it does not mean. Absolutely does not mean it is not a responsibility of all of us toward one another. Each one of us should watch the needs of our brethren, and when we see brethren struggling, you know, under the weight of a trial or the loneliness that death produces, the death of a spouse or fighting an illness, whatever the case may be, we have a responsibility to watch one another.

If we see any of our brethren seemingly losing heart, maybe they’re not making comments in class a lot as much as they used to, or they just don’t have that twinkle in their eye and that little hop in their step, reach out. What can we do? This is a sacred responsibility that all the body has, one to another. Brother Tom, I think especially sisters on sisters, I think that works really well. I think Cheryl is very good at contacting other sisters and making sure that they’re okay.

And it’s just a more natural connection there. So there is certainly a place for that personal thing. The other suggestion I wanted to make for this is not to lose heart is to try to be involved in some physical service for the Lord. Because every time you do that, you might ask yourself, why am I doing this? And especially if it’s something more difficult, it’s because you’re serving the king of the universe.

You’re preparing for the kingdom. You’ve got all the good noble sentiments that supports why you’re physically sacrificing for something greater. Cause. Yeah. What did Jesus say?

She did what she could. What can we do? Brother John, your comments just remind me of First Corinthians 12:25, and just simply the members should have the same care, one for another. It’s not only on the elders.

It’s a very good point, and a few years ago, the Muhammad ecclesiastical for our business meeting study. One of the brethren asked, you know, we always study what the responsibilities of the elders are, but what’s the responsibility of the ecclesia? And we ended up studying Romans 12. There’s quite a lot in there about our responsibility to each other as individual members of the body.

So just Recommend that. All right, Very good. All right, let’s go on to question seven. Why was David referred to as a prophet when he was actually a king? And the scriptural reference is Acts 2:29 31.

Brethren, I may say unto you freely of the patriarch David that he both died and was buried, and his tomb is with us unto this day. Being therefore a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn an oath to him that of the fruit of his loins he would set upon his throne, he foreseeing this spake of the resurrection of Christ, that neither was he left unto Hades, nor did his flesh see corruption, and Paul or Peter is quoting Psalm 16:10 there, a Psalm of David. It’s called a Miktam of David, and that verse says, for that will that will not leave my soul in Sheol, neither wilt thou suffer thy holy One to see corruption.

So that’s the prophetic reference. So once again, the question, why was David referred to as a prophet when he was actually a king?

Well, I would say that’s a pretty easy one because he was both. Even in that X account, he’s quoting a prophecy. I think it’s very obvious that he was a king. So he didn’t need to say that, but to indicate that he’s a prophet. I mean, you go through Psalm 22, it’s about the sacrifice of our Lord, why hast thou forsaken me?

That’s from Psalm 22. Or from Psalm 2. Why do the heathen rage? You know, that’s all the prophetic application for the end of the age. So the Psalms and David’s writings are full of prophecies.

So he was a. What an honor for him, when you think about that, to be both a prophet and a king. Yeah. It’s interesting in this Acts here that Peter calls him a patriarch as well, which he was. So the idea is that these different roles are not exclusionary.

You can be one and another. Brother John, did you have something to add just second Peter 1:21 says, no prophecy was ever made by an act of human will, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God. It doesn’t just say prophets, because there are many that had prophecies that weren’t what we normally would say as a prophet, and then, you know, Samuel is referred to also as a prophet, and we know he was a judge. So just the multiple role, I think.

Point, and then two Psalms I really love. Psalm 145 is a prophetic Psalm about the kingdom, and Psalm 37 is a prophetic psalm about how in the end, evil will be destroyed. You know what happens with the permission of evil. Okay, thank you, Brother John.

Question nine is, what’s your favorite psalm of David? And I think that John is giving us a little hint of that. Go ahead, Brother John. There’s one distinction between him and Jesus. Jesus was a prophet, priest and king.

The priest is distinction there. David wasn’t a priest. Very interesting. Very interesting. All right, let’s go on.

Oh, boy. One more question here. I’ll go with Bill first. Well, then I think that shows you that these are. You can make pictures out of these.

You know, that’s my point on the whole thing. I think you can look at deeper levels and understandings of these things. When you look at that Psalm 16, which is a prophetic psalm of David. It’s called a mictam. What’s a miktam, Brother John?

All I could find is the commentators think it’s some kind of reference to a particular kind of music.

And there are more than one scripture that are referred to as miktam. There’s also one called shigeon, which they think is also another musical term, but we don’t. I don’t know what it is. Yeah, there’s several different things, like a mascul. You see that the mascule is evasive as well.

I looked it up and bottom line is they don’t know. But here’s what they said. A mictam is likely a literary or musical term, as you said Brother John used to describe a certain Psalm of David, possibly indicating their preciousness, engraved permanence, or a specific style. But because the term appears only a few times and is not explained, its precise meaning remains a mystery. So anyway, I like your answer.

Let’s go on to number eight, and this may turn our panel into maybe a little bit of a testimony meeting. The question Brother Tom mentioned, Ebenezers. Could each of the elders share a personal. Ebenezer?

Brother Tom, you brought the subject up, so you go first. That’s not fair. Well, I hesitated to share this one, but I will. I think I was about 19 years old and I thought it would be really neat to go visit the Brethren on the East Coast, and so we spent a little over a week there.

And we spent three or four days with Bob and Becky Gray, and we had studies with them and it was great. But they suggested that some of us go out cul portering during the day, and we did that and we had some nice experiences. We had one gentleman who wanted to have a study, so we invited him over that night, and of course he never showed up.

But the experience was extraordinary because it made me think colporting is okay. I don’t know that I was really cut out for that, but I knew I wanted to do something in the Lord’s service and I was already consecrated and I was already doing something in Chicago, but it wasn’t enough. So I came home and I talked to my parents and I said, I want to create a plan so that I don’t have to work full time, and so we heal. My dad owned a small apartment building and that’s all he knew.

He says, well, why don’t we do something together? And we did. We bought a building together and I managed it for a while, and anyway, it was a long story, took a long time, but I was able to go to work part time when I was a little over 30 years old. I still had to do something because you still have to eat, you know.

But that changed my life, and I made bad decisions along the way here and there, and it took longer than it should have, and what I learned from that is that you can make your plans and when they’re noble and good, the Lord will bless them, but you need to learn other things along the way, and so he didn’t make it so easy for me, but the lessons were extraordinary. It taught me who to trust, where my value should remain, how to plan my life out.

And the best decision I ever made was who I married.

Sorry, sorry, sorry.

Because I married someone who was willing to do it and to work with me and to work hard at it and who shared the vision. It was my vision. So for someone else to come into it and say, okay, let’s do this, this sounds really good. It’s been a rich blessing and we still work together to this day, and I’ll tell you, when it works, it’s really rich.

And I thank the Lord every day for that. So that’s my Ebenezer. Thank you. Well, I’d rate that as a diamond, Ebenezer. Very nice.

Very nice, brother.

Well, you know, piggybacking on what Tom said, only making it maybe a little more blunt or clear than he did. Part of it is in planning. You know, Shane and I have had the opportunity to travel extensively, but it had all to do with early on, planning, and when we do plan to go somewhere, you know, you have your itinerary, what you’re going to do, but it always seems like it changes. So let’s just say, you know, and we kind of just go with the flow.

We’re not very rigid when we do this. So let’s just take one example, and we look at these as all the Lord’s overrulings, everything we do. So this year we had a plan to go to Normandy, but then there was three immersions that were going to happen in France at Lamerlais. So we changed our plans and we changed our bus tickets and we did all that.

We got down to Lamrolay, and then we were blessed by being with 80 brethren, you know, and 80 brethren in France, that’s a big deal. I mean, that’s. You know, there were brethren from Germany, their brethren, you know, some of the Moldovans were there, and then the French brethren from a number of different areas were there. So it really turned out to be a very nice blessing.

So I guess, you know, I mean, an Ebenezer, personal Ebenezer, I would just say, you know, we need to be flexible as brethren, and I’m, you know, I like my plans. I like to have things, you know, like they are. But I’ve learned that being flexible is paramount because things can come up and you reap the benefits if you can be flexible, and there’s lots of people that help us out as we travel, we meet people, we have a fairly really good time.

The other thing is, you know, I can’t be more blessed than to have, like Brother Tom said, a wife that’s willing to do and go and be a partner in doing all this, and I think that’s an important lesson for maybe anybody that’s considering marriage that is single. Make sure you can be evenly yoked, because if you’re not, then it’s going to be an uphill battle. So, you know, we both love the truth, we both love the Lord. We both love working with it.

We both love entertaining. We both love doing everything that we kind of do together. So I think that’s. This is a big picture. I know this is more of a semi focused, pinpointing thing, but this is more of a big picture because there’s many blessings.

If you looked at just one thing and said, oh, this is the big blessing to me, every day is a blessing. Being here is a blessing. This has been a tremendous blessing for me to see the brethren and to be with them and to have fellowship with certain ones that we had. I mean, it’s really. It’s a mountaintop experience.

So anyway, that’ll be my testimony. Okay, thank you, Brother John. Mine would be along the lines of A Word in Season. You know how important that is. Years ago, before Sister Karen and I were married.

We were dating, and we lived about an hour and a half apart, and I would travel, and I’d always ask brethren if they wanted to go. The area we lived in had a lot of widows. Well, I find for myself, I love dialogue, just interchange, and sometimes among the brethren, they can have a real need to speak and to share, and you might not get a word in edgewise, you know.

And I was taking his sister several times on these trips, and I was pretty frustrated because every time I tried to enter a dialogue, I ended up hearing this long monologue, and I was really concerned about it, and I asked, I shared the general experience. Brother Bob Gray, and he kind of took me to task.

He said, brother John, that sister is a widow. She has no one at home to talk to, and I had. You know, I had my mom at home at that time before Karen and I married, and, you know, that just turned my thinking around.

And I found. This is really kind of funny now when I look back. Back. But I found if I just gave the sister the first half hour and I didn’t say anything, she said everything she needed to say, and then we had an hour, we could actually dialogue. Wow, what a beautiful, beautiful description.

We can bless others by just being a listener, and others sometimes need to express themselves, and they need somebody to talk to, a shoulder to cry on, somebody to share with. Very nice. Well, the Ebenezer, as Brother Tom said, is a stone of help, and so the experiences that were very helpful in our walk, all of us have had many Ebenezers.

So I tried to think of one. Back in 1992, at the International convention, there was a busload of brethren from Romania attempted to come to the convention. Now, many of you may be aware of this, they didn’t make it because of problems with the bus. They were stopped at the German border, and those dear brethren spent 30, 40 hours in the hot summertime on a bus. It was a very difficult experience.

So for the 1994 convention, I had the president privilege of chairing that convention. That year. I was told the Romanian brethren aren’t coming. They don’t want to go through that again. Well, in 1993, we were at the New Brunswick convention, and brother Sammy Stalder was staying at the Grays.

I think Kathy and I were staying there as well. But we were having some fellowship after the convention, and Sammy said to me, he says, brother David, you have to go to Romania. You’re chairman of the 94 Convention. You have to let them know that there’s not going to be a problem, and I said, well, okay, that’s a strong.

That’s a stretch there for me to get to Romania, and he insisted. So, you know, and he explained the reason why you have to talk with them and do what you need to reassure them so they could come. So we got home and Kathy and I talked about it. You know, the cost to go to Romania.

You know, it was expensive and we didn’t have a whole lot of money. So we talked about it and prayed about it, and we both agreed, all right, well, we should bite the bullet on this. You know, this appears to be what the Lord wants. Wants you to do, and by the way, Samuel Antique said, you know, just get to our house and we’ll take care of everything, you know, so that was the big thing.

So we prayed and we said, okay, this is what we’re doing, going to do, and I looked at what the costs were. About a day or two later, I got this envelope in the mail, and the envelope had a little note to was a check. It was given anonymously, and it almost exactly covered the cost of the airfare.

This was a kiss from the Heavenly Father. But notice I didn’t get the help until we made the decision. When you take the step into making a sacrifice for the Brethren, we often get feedback from the Lord. So it was an Ebenezer to me, because it said, yeah, I know what’s going on in your life and I know what you need to do, and I’ll make sure that you can do it, and by the way, I spent 10 days on the road with Sammy and indeed Stalder, and that was more than enough payback for blessing.

I mean, we never stopped talking for 10 days. I think most of you have had that experience when you travel with the Brethren, never run out of things. So that was one of my Ebenezers, really, a stone of help. The Lord helped me and just reassured me of his sonship, my sonship to him and his interest in our service. Brother John, just one thing that has been really helpful to me.

If the brethren look at 1st Samuel 4, when the Ark is lost by Eli’s two sons, and you look at 1st Samuel 7, where the Ebenezer stone is raised, where they have this great victory, it’s the same place, and that says to me, sometimes the places where we’ve had defeats, the Lord can help us to victory, and that’s especially a place to put up an Ebenezer. What a nice application. I never picked that up before.

Beautiful, beautiful. All right, brethren, well, let’s go to question nine. This is sort of in the realm of a testimony as well. What is your favorite Psalm of David and why?

Brother Bill, I can go first on this. You know, songs, songs that we listen to maybe on the radio or the song of the year or whatever. Music kind of changes. So I think, what is our favorite hymn that changes with me also. I do have some that I prefer over others, but sometimes I like other hymns.

And so that is my favorite one. So the same thing with the Psalms and. Or the Scriptures. There are ones I used to think were my favorite. I used to really like, you know, Jeremiah 31, 30, 31, and then Revelation 22:17.

But there’s other ones that I like, you know, just as much, if not more than those now. But those are some of the ones that stuck in my head. So with Psalms, after this study that I had here, I really like Psalm 51. I’ve been thinking about that a lot, because that kind of played into my discussion yesterday, and that was, you know, there were other ones that I’ve liked along the way.

But I think, you know, life kind of changes. Things change, evolve, whatever, and so, you know, Psalm 51 is something I’m thinking about more and more now. I’m sure others have got their reasons, but I can’t say I’ve always liked this. You know, I read through Psalms, and this is my number one Psalm that I like.

It’s, I guess how you know where you are in your life and how things apply to him at that time. All right, very good. Brother Tom, you have a favorite Psalm of David. I love Psalm 27, but only portions of it, because he talks a lot about fear and trouble. But I like especially verses 1 and 4.

It says, the Lord is my light and my salvation. Whom shall I fear? The Lord is the strength of my life. Of whom shall I be afraid? One thing have I desired of the Lord, that will I seek after.

Sorry.

That I may dwell in the house of the Lord all the days of my life, to behold the beauty of the Lord and to inquire in his temple. There is nothing greater that we could possibly want in our life. The ability to look at the truth, to open up his word, to see the beauty of who he is and what he’s done and what he will yet do, and then to have the freedom to inquire in his temple, to ask questions, to know, what does this mean? What’s the symbolism here?

That’s the greatest privilege any human being can have, and I think we are so blessed to know what we know and to deal with the Creator of the universe who would condescend to to be our Heavenly Father. It’s just more than words can explain. What an awesome Father we have in Jehovah. God indeed.

Brother John, I agree with the comment about, you know, it changes over time and I think in terms like I mentioned Psalm 145. If one is discouraged by how bad they see things getting in the world, read Psalm Psalm 145. It will lift you up. Sometimes we get discouraged by experiences we have at work and it’s hard to understand. I guess I need to appreciate Jesus words more.

Marvel not if the world hates you, because I marvel. It seems like nobody deserves to be treated this way. How can they act this way? And Sister Karen would remind me of Psalm 37, fret not yourself because of evildoers, and it goes into about they will be looked for someday in the future and they won’t be found because they will be converted to righteousness.

So that is very helpful. But the one that has really meant a lot to me recently and this was assigned to me at a convention, but it is Psalm 71, and the reason I like Psalm 71, well, I love all the refrains of Take refuge in the Lord. You find that so much in David’s writings, and actually this psalm, it is not clear if David wrote it, but I think he did because I think it fit his experience.

But basically it talks about one who has been faithful from the time they were a child until old age, and I love that because of the consistency, you know, we’re inconsistent. I want to have that consistent service to the Lord, and so that psalm just really inspires me. Thank you.

Brother John, you made reference to one of my favorite psalms. It’s right up there on top, has been for years, Psalm 37.

Psalm 37 has a number of verses in it that are just absolutely a delight. But I frequently will call on Psalm 37:4 and 5 in my emails. Many of you have seen emails from me. You’ll see that I quote that Delight thyself also in Jehovah, and he will give thee the desires of your heart. Commit thy way unto Jehovah, trust also in him, and he will bring it to pass.

I love this idea that he’s going to give you the desires of your heart, and we worked up a whole lesson on evaluating what the desires of the heart are.

There is a qualifier in here. If you delight yourself in Jehovah, then you will have the Correct. Desires of the heart doesn’t say he’ll give you any desire of the heart, but he’ll give you the desires of your heart if you delight in him, and, you know, we’re back to will and to do. The Heavenly Father creates in us that desire to serve him, and he reinforces that by giving us kisses as we serve him, reinforcing this delightful fellowship that we have among one another.

So, anyway, 37 is about my favorite. All right, let’s go on to question 10. There are two questions there that were testimonies, so I think testimonies are good. Question 10. Why did God have 1st Samuel 30 included in the account of David’s life?

What does David’s battle with the Amalekites add to David’s history? Now, let’s say specific. We could generalize the question and say, you know, why are all these other things included in the account of David? I made mention he had two different battles with the Philistines, one after another. Why was that included?

So why are some of these things included not only in David’s history, but in the Bible? Why are things in the Bible? I went from specific to general. But what do you think, Brother Bill? Well, you know, when Joshua crosses the Jordan, there’s a number of battles that go on there.

And, you know, crossing the Jordan, it’s a similar picture from a different angle of Moses delivering the children through the Red Sea. Right. So I think these are more battles into the kingdom that people get rid of sin. I think that’s a lot of the pictures of these battles. So, you know, that would be.

I mean, I got to read through this whole thing to see exactly what it pictures and all that. You know, there’s so much detail to this that you really got to. I mean, for 12 hours, I got to think a lot more about what this represents. But I have in my mind when Joshua crossed the Jordan and what happened there, I’ve thought about that a little more deeper, and so I think these are probably similar things.

And the kingdom. The kingdom’s a thousand years long. Does it have to be a thousand years? Well, it’s going to be a thousand years for a reason, because there’s a lot of things people have to put under.

And we see it because we read the Bible, we’re meditating on this, and we see the reflection. This is Jesus and this is us. The two don’t match up too good. So we have to fight these things anyway. All right, thank you, Brother Tom.

Well, I think we have to kind of relate the story a little bit. If the Brethren haven’t read it, it’s an interesting story. The Amalekites attacked a little town called Ziglag. They burned it to the ground. They took David’s wives and all his children and everyone who lived there captive, which is interesting.

They didn’t kill him. They took him captive for some reason. So the first thing David does is he calls for the high priest and he says, bring the Ephod, because the Urim and Thummim were probably stored in the Ephod, and so, again, back to your point, David, he inquires of the Lord, what should I do? He said, should I chase them?

And the answer is, yes, you should chase them. Will we catch them? Yes. Will we save our families? Yes.

So he gets all these answers, and so he’s confident that when he goes, it’s all going to work out. He takes 600 men with them, and as they’re chasing him through the desert, 200 men said, we can’t keep doing this. We’re just either too old or too tired. So he lets 200 stay, and he takes 400 and he catches Amalekites. He gets his family back.

And the fact that the emphasis in this chapter is on the women, not on the men necessarily, or even the children, I think shows a sensitivity to David. This is not just a male society. He cared for the women as well. He cared for his family and his wife. So anyway, they get them all back, and they come back to where the 200 men are.

They capture all the things that the Amalekites had, and David said, okay, now let’s distribute this among the 600. Not the 400, the 600, and the 400 said, wait a minute. That’s not fair.

They stayed back. Why should they get any of it? And David says, no, they’re part of our army. They’re going to get their fair share. So there’s a little jealousy there from the 400.

And I thought, well, one lesson was David’s generosity, that he saw they weren’t staying back because they were cowards. They were either old or for some reason, he was sympathetic to that. I think if I had to chase them, I would have stayed back a lot sooner. I think it does show David’s generosity and his care for women. So it’s just another story that gives us a little insight into David’s character.

I’m glad it was in there. Well, thank you for that overview. Very nicely put, Brother John. Yeah, I’d just add in verse six. It Points out when he comes back with his army and they find the city burned, that some wanted to stone him.

And I think that’s another lesson in leadership, of how David handles this, because sometimes there is difficult opposition. You might question your course, and it’s interesting because the preceding chapter, the Philistines have just dismissed David. David and his army, they’re going to attack Israel, and one of the Philistine kings have asked David to come.

And the rest of Philistines say, well, this is the one that it was said, he slays his ten thousands, and it was us he was slaying, and so he sent away, and he could have come back and seen his home burned and the family all gone, and, you know, concluded this was something the Lord’s correcting me for, and I just appreciate how he goes to the Lord, as Brother Tom said.

The other thing I wonder about is if this is a little picture of restitution because the people aren’t killed like Brother Tom brought out, and they rescue all of them, and they actually get more plunder than what was just from their city, and it’s sort of like Job, when the Lord restores good fortune to him, he has double. So I just wonder about that at first. Baleshev was double the question. Okay, very nicely put, Bill.

And I think, you know, what Brother Tom put forward, I think you can look at it, you know, just as deep. The parable of the penny. Everybody gets the same wages at the end, right? And then the 600. Is that the 6,000 years of sin and death going away with what you talked about?

You know, it’s the same. Same concept there. So, anyway, okay, all right, let me summarize in the case of David here, what the reasons would be that the Lord included that. So I’m basically summarizing what all three of you said. Number one, it rounds out the picture of David.

It gives us more details into his personality, in his character. In other words, it’s a better biography because of what this is. Number two, it has prophetic, possibly prophetic pictures or maybe even doctrinal. We didn’t mention any doctrinal. But stories that are included, like this one can have prophetic application as well as doctrinal application.

And number three, personal application. What are we learning from this that we can apply in our lives? And I think those three levels apply to a lot of things that are included in some scripture. We say why I mentioned yesterday in my talk, we’ve got a beautiful picture of David’s mighty men. You know, why?

Why all of that, well, number three, it rounds out, tells us a little bit about what David’s life was like, what his choices he made. Number two, it may have some very prophetic and doctrinal situations, and number three, apply it to ourself. I want to surround myself with mighty men, mighty men and women who are consecrated in the Lord. I know it’ll help me.

So that’s the general thing. Remember I mentioned in my lesson yesterday something I believe firmly. There is nothing superfluous in Scripture. In the inspired word of God. God selected everything that would be included.

He also decided what wouldn’t be included, and if we take that from the standpoint of God’s wanting us to appreciate and love His Word, then we will study the Bible as we study no other book. This is the work of God. Therefore, by definition, everything has meaning and application, and none of us are going to plumb the whole Bible in our lifetime.

There’s just so much there. Brother Tom, what brother Bill said made me think of some of the attitudes that may be in the Kingdom. You know, I lived a good life. Why is that person going to live forever just like me? Why is Adolf Hitler going to get a chance for eternal life?

Look what he did. He doesn’t deserve that, and yet the gifts of God are not set by man’s standard, by man’s judgment. Generosity is a wonderful quality of our Heavenly Father. He does things for those who don’t deserve it.

The ransom. We don’t deserve that. The resurrection of the dead. Does mankind deserve that after 6,000 years of sin? So if there is a symbolism there, if not just the whole attitude of David’s generosity is really kind of beautiful.

Yeah, we can understand why the times of restitution are centuries long, a thousand years, that there’s a lot of work that has to be done. I mean, just look at how difficult it has been for us in our consecrated lives to wage war against our flesh. I mean, we work for decades and we still have flaws. We make mistakes, we say things we shouldn’t say, we think things we shouldn’t think. Fortunately, the Lord is judging us on our heart.

You know, what we would do if we had perfect control. No different with the world of mankind. Except they won’t have to deal with the world and the devil, they just have to deal with. Deal with the flesh. But it will be the same type of battle and an extensive battle, and for some, a very difficult battle.

Very good. Let’s go on. Question 11. Was there any idolatry in David’s reign?

Brother John? Well, I looked to see if there was anything recorded. I think there probably was. Just because idolatry is like the besetting sin of Israel. When you read through the histories, you find again and again and again they fall into idolatry.

And that is, you know, a violation of both the first and second covenants, the two most important first mentioned. But in David’s reign, in the passages, I couldn’t find anything that referred to idolatry except one place, and that’s 1 Chronicles 16:26, and this is interesting. This is in David’s song of praise when they took the ark into the tabernacle, and it just says there, for all the gods of the peoples are idols.

But the Lord made the heavens. So it’s very clear he understood how evil idolatry was and the contrast between images of wood and stone and the creator of the universe. Okay, very good. Brother Tom or Brother Bill, anything to add? Well, I didn’t find anything either, and certainly nothing in David’s life except personal idolatry, you call pride and idolatry, if you want to go to that extent.

There was obviously, and I think maybe amongst the citizenry of Israel, there might have been hidden idolatry. But of course, David was very opposed to physically worshiping idols and statues and things. So that was all suppressed under David’s rain. But who knows what Israelite might have been worshipping an idol secretly. Certainly would have got in trouble if David found out, I think.

Yeah, that’s right. He wouldn’t have tolerated that. Bill, you have anything else? I thought Michael had, you know, one of his wives. Michael had some idolatrous things that she had.

I have to look that up. But I think that. Okay, Brother Tom, you. I looked at that briefly when David was running from Saul, she put an image in the bed to make it look like he was sleeping. It’s not clear that that was an idol, though.

It could have been anything to make it look like it was him. I doubt that it was an idol because David was there. He wouldn’t have allowed that. But some suggest that. But I don’t think that’s right.

Very, very good. You know, I think this illustrates something you said yesterday, Brother Tom, that. That as the faith and fidelity and obedience of the leader of Israel went, so the rest of the nation, idolatry was largely gone, as you say. There may have been pockets, probably were pockets of it, but it didn’t come from the top. What came from the top is iconoclasm.

Get rid of the idols, smash them, and David was very, very firm on that, and so the nation prospered. The sin of idolatry was not a sin that they had to deal with very much during the reign of David, Brother Bill, and I think that principle spills over to, you know, the 6,000 years of sin and death. I mean, it shows, you know, who’s your leader today?

Who’s the leaders of the nations, the different nations. Who keeps the nations on the straight and narrow? Which ones aren’t on the straight and narrow? I think it’s, you know, that principle really kind of goes right along with, with what’s happening today, and I think that’s a good thing to kind of watch and see where things are going, to see who’s the leadership, who’s in control and how do they control the nation, you know, And I mean, we can give lots of examples.

That’s just a kind of a face value type of thing that applies to today. Okay. I think someday the world will not need leadership to show them what’s right. It will become inherent in their hearts and they will know who it’s right to worship, and so during the millennium they’re going to need that, but in the ages to come, it’s going to be written in their hearts.

And I think they will be an example for other creations in the universe. Yeah, I think you’re exactly right. During the mediatorial phase, the leadership will be holy and they’ll be ruling with a rod of iron. They will enforce things. That’s a big difference.

That’s right. The policing of the world will be very thorough at that time, but the people will rejoice. There’s a psalm somewhere. It says that when the judgments of Jehovah are in the earth, the people rejoice because they know what’s expected. There’s no more ambiguity.

And again, the world and Satan is gone and they’ll see the blessings that flow from it, and Tom, I love your thought that by the end of the month, millennium, this is the job that we have been called to do, is to write the law of God in the hearts of men so that they are forever crystallized in righteousness and injustice. That’s our challenge and that’s what we’re being trained to do right now. So that when we get beyond the veil, we’ll be able to help mankind, and so we’ve got to write it in our hearts now so we can write it in their hearts in the future.

Exactly. Help them out. Sure. All right. Question 12 really is the same as question 3.

I’ll read it. We’re not going to take it because we answered it already. Please explain. 2nd Samuel 24:1 compared with Exodus 30:12. Did God move David to do this?

This is the census many commentaries attribute to Satan. So we covered this pretty well. So I’m going to go on to number 13. In 2nd Samuel 7:21 in 1st Chronicles 7:20, David refers to God’s heart. Is there any other ancient worthy who mentioned this?

Why would David say this? What would it mean?

Who’d like to tackle this question? I don’t have the full question, so just can you read it just one more time for me please? Yes. In 2nd Samuel 21, David refers to refers to God’s heart. Is there any other ancient worthy who mentioned this?

Why would David say this? What would it mean? Brother John? Well, just to start, this is David’s comment to the Lord. It’s at the time that David wants to build the house for God.

And God responds, no, I’m going to build you a house. It wasn’t for him, and so I mean David had to. I mean, brethren, don’t you feel humbled and the dust sometime by the Lord’s favor? And here I think that’s David’s attitude that he sees just the great loving kindness, the great graciousness of our Father, that he’s going to build a house for David.

And so I think that’s why he makes this point. For thy word’s sake, and according to thine own heart. Hast thou done all these great things to make thy servants know them? You know, David had a special view of God.

He was humble and that’s the position we have to have to really appreciate the greatness of our God, and so he gets this privilege of seeing, you know, the Lord’s heart, that great generosity. Very nice. Anything to add? I didn’t see these last questions, but that’s an interesting one.

I think as Brother John said, it expresses the humility in David. He saw that any good in him is only because of God. Any good work that he would do is because of God, and I think that should be reflective of everyone running for the high calling. My goodness, we’re called to the divine nature, immortality.

We don’t deserve that. We’re not capable of earning that or even being worthy of that. So any good that comes through us is because of the greatness of God and the goodness of his heart. So that attitude is really a church attitude. I think that should be reflected in all of us.

Yeah, yeah. I love the way that Jehovah flipped the script on David. I’d like to build you a house. No, not going to let you, but I’m going to build you one. What a beautiful, beautiful comment.

Any of the ancient worthies speak of God’s heart this way, do you think?

I found a few. It’s not the same words, but remember, we say God is love. We’re talking about God’s heart, the wellsprings of God, of Jehovah’s heart is just full of love. Moses in Deuteronomy 7, 7 through 8, we read it was not because you were more in number, but it is because Jehovah loves you and is keeping the oath he swore to your father. Fathers.

Now, Moses here is pointing to God’s love and promise, not Israel’s merit. You know, like David, Samuel, 1st Samuel 13, 14, Jehovah sought out a man after his own heart. Now here’s a mention of his heart. He’s speaking of David, of course. So here’s another mention of David’s heart as well.

Jeremiah, Jeremiah 32:41, I will rejoice in them good with all my heart and all my soul. Another reflection of Jehovah’s heart, very similar to 2nd Samuel 7. So, I mean, what does that mean from a doctrinal standpoint? It means that God does not act out of obligation, but but out of delight. God delights to do good to his creatures and his covenants and his promises flow from his character.

Again, we’re talking about his heart, not man’s worthiness, as you mentioned, Brother Tom, and God’s plans for us originate from a desire to bless the whole universe. I mean, we’ve been called to be part of Jesus effort in his kingdom to reconstruct mankind, to reconstitute mankind in the image of God, the image that they originally created it. But that’s only the start of things that our Heavenly Father is going to have us to do. I say this often in our class.

I said, Imagine us 10 trillion years from now. God gathers together his divine family, 144,000 Jesus, and he says, hey, I got an idea. What do you think of this? Whoa, that’s wonderful. That will happen for all eternity.

That is the infinite depth of our Heavenly Father. Brother John, the closest I could find, and this goes to the point about a man after God’s own heart. But how would you like to have an angel describe you as man greatly blessed? And we find that twice in the scriptures, in Daniel 10, 11, 19, that the Lord loved him because, you know, he was faithful and looked to the Lord.

But here we have David as a man after God’s own heart. But here is one that God loved especially, and remember what Jesus said of his disciples and of you and I, the Father himself loveth you. We are greatly beloved as well as Daniel was. Again, it’s mind blowing.

You know, as all of you have said, we’re not worthy of this, and yet God chooses to bestow his love, his mercy, his grace upon us because he sees what he can make us into and he sees how he can use us to bless all of the universe for all eons to come. Martin’s number 14. What role do you imagine David will have in the mediatorial phase of the kingdom?

Brother John? Well, brother David, I like a point. There’s a talk Rick Cunningham has about the different ancient world worthies and what they bring in the kingdom, and David’s a warrior. Will he be especially useful when the Lord raises up the ancient worthies?

During Gog and Magog, David had all kinds of problems with children. Will he be able to relate to parents who have had difficulties in that way? I think you can go through, and I love Noah, because mankind after the time of trouble may feel like, well, we have nothing to start from. Well, no, because, and say we did it, we started over, you know.

So I think you have to look at the particular experiences that David had and what will that bring, and I can’t help but think one aspect of this. He’ll have to face Uriah and have to correct himself. I mean, it’ll be a full, I think, perfecting there for him to have that experience to face the one he murdered. Yeah, I mean, that’s an important point of justice.

The Heavenly Father doesn’t allow any string of justice to go unaddressed, and I thought about that same thing. Can you imagine that meeting of Uriah? And by the way, I wouldn’t put it out of the question that Uriah is one of the ancient worthies. He was a man.

He’s called Uriah the Gittite. He’s evidently not a native Israelite. He was a proselyte. Now, I just could have come from that Israelite coming from that city as well. But look at the loyalty and faith.

He wanted to do what he felt God’s will. If he was a proselyte, that means he made a consecration to Judaism at that time and he died doing what was right. He may well be an ancient murthy, but that will be an interesting thing, the meeting of David and Uriah, and you know, it’s going to go beautifully. Brother Bill well, you know, when we look at the ancient word of these, we look at maybe the positions that they had, and you think about how can the kingdom run with these different ones.

So you’ve got Daniel, he was third in command, so I think he knows how to run things. Joseph was number two in the kingdom, so he knows how to run things. Right? And so David was king. I think he would know how to run things.

Not as a warrior, though, you know, he knows how to run a kingdom that was prosperous and very successful, very successful, and the battles that, you know, they went against, I think those show the sin that we have to get rid of on a bigger level. So I think that’s what they take into the kingdom. I want to read three scriptures to you, brethren, and get your feedback on it, and this is in direct answer to the question, what is the role of David in the mediatorial kingdom?

Ezekiel 34, 23 and 24, and I will set up one shepherd over them, and he shall feed them. Even my servant David, he shall feed them, and he shall be their shepherd, and, and I, Jehovah, will be their God, and my servant David, prince among them. I, Jehovah, have spoken of it again.

The context here is Kingdom. Ezekiel 37, 24 and 25, and my servant David shall be king over them, and they all shall have one shepherd, and shall also walk in mine ordinances and observe my statutes and do them, and they shall dwell in the land that I have given unto Jacob, my servant, wherein your fathers dwelt.

And they shall dwell therein, they and their children, and their children’s children forever, and David my servant shall be their prince forever, and lastly Jeremiah 39. But they shall serve Jehovah their God, and David their king, whom I will raise up unto them.

So what do you think these scriptures say about David’s role in the mediatorial kingdom, Brother Tom? Well, it’s very similar to what I was talking about, being a shepherd king. He learned how to be a shepherd of people by being a shepherd of sheep, by looking at their needs, and so if we’re going to imagine here, we have some freedom to imagine, right? I imagine Moses being the lawgiver, explaining what the rules are and going around explaining what the details are.

I envision Isaiah and Jeremiah going around the world explaining the meaning of all the prophecies they gave, because that’s the role they were in. I imagine David, when he was king, he didn’t just sit on the throne, he toured. He Went around the country, and I see David doing that as well because there’s a lot of backwards countries, a backwards way of looking at things that have to be straightened out, and if he was a shepherd, he could look at that need and say, okay, I know what you need, here’s what you need.

This is a principle you need to apply. So I see them more very involved and active, traveling in the world, not just sitting in Jerusalem as the center of government, but being actively involved because I think that’s how their role was when they lived. So that’s an imagination. Yeah, and do you think that a title king might be given to him?

It was. Well, at the time, yeah, I think so. I think so. Brother John, Brother Bill. Well, I just want to.

I can’t pass David with two things. One was his devotional nature. Can you imagine being asked, being able to ask David in the kingdom, what did you mean when you wrote that the Lord forgives the iniquity of my sin, for example, he’ll be able to personally share, and I think he’ll again be an example of divorce, great devotion there, and the other thing is, as horrible as jealousy is, that’s something that will be conquered in the kingdom.

And I can see him having a big role in that. One other interesting aspect of this, I think, is he’s part of the faith line of the Messiah. So these all point, the scriptures you had all point to Messiah, but he’s set a pattern, I think. You think of the respons. Responsibility Brother Bill brought out about how all the kings were compared to David.

Well, wouldn’t that have been preparation for Messiah? Yeah, very good, Bill. Nothing additional.

I saw Rolando’s shadow over me. Just let me a comment on that. Just one quick one. Go ahead. You know, when we traveled to England this year, I traveled to Dover Castle and I was talking with the curator there a little bit and he talked to me about, you know, the kings of Europe or England, they would only spend a couple days at each one of these castles.

That’s what they’re, you know, so they traveled their country to make sure their realm was in order, and so I think, you know, pigging back on what Brother Tom said, I think the same thing might happen, you know, not making sure that their realm is an order. Order, but to teach the people and not just sit and, you know, as we might think, on some throne or something, but interacting with everybody, to making sure everybody gets their opportunity to walk up that highway of holiness. Yeah. Reigning becomes a dynamic verb rather than a passive one One last comment on these three scriptures that we read that David is often representative of Jesus.

He’s the son of David. But you notice that in the scriptures that I read that there are some that designate him as king and some that designate him as prince.

Two of them in fact made mention of prince here. So I can’t help but wonder if the application, besides being to the actual King David raised as an ancient world, is to Jesus where the kingship is involved and where its prince. It’s really referring to a civil authority that David will be given, and as prince. It doesn’t surprise us because the word prince in Ezekiel’s temple, the prince and elsewhere is often used collectively to describe the regal stature of the the ancient worthies in the kingdom.

They are the visible representatives of the heavenly kingdom, and as princes they have regal authority in the name of the reigning kings.

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